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Date: 26 Jan 2009 00:03:55
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Guess slams are a little different after all
Murray favourite for this AO? LOL




 
Date: 28 Jan 2009 23:58:43
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 Jan, 17:46, Joe Ramirez <josephmrami...@netzero.com > wrote:

> If Verdasco gets to play Nadal here, it won't
> be enough merely to produce a sharply improved level of play -- he
> will also have to break down his mental block.

Exactly. Which is why I'd be very surprised if he managed to win (plus
I'd be disappointed - the final would become a cakewalk for Fed/
Roddick).





 
Date: 28 Jan 2009 23:53:51
From: xamigax@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 23:36, "xami...@gmail.com" <xami...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On 26 jan, 18:46, Joe Ramirez <josephmrami...@netzero.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 26, 12:18=A0pm, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > > On Jan 26, 7:54=A0am, "Vari L. Cinicke" <cini...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
> > > > Sakari Lund wrote:
> > > > > On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> > > > > <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > > > >> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
> > > > >> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's alway=
s a
> > > > >> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, s=
o far
> > > > >> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his mov=
ement
> > > > >> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > > > > Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the firs=
t
> > > > > time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> > > > > silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> > > > > I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and po=
sted
> > > > > about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> > > > > picked him for the final.
>
> > > > > But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>
> > > > Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and =
his
> > > > work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.
>
> > > > This is another milestone for him.
>
> > > > Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Im=
agine
> > > > how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.
>
> > > > --
> > > > Cheers,
>
> > > > vc
>
> > > ++ He was running down some wide outs that were just a waste of
> > > energy... I doubt Murray has another level of cardio capacity... he's
> > > 6'3"... he's a big guy... only so much capacity given height-weight
> > > ratios... the BIG guy phenomena begins to factor in to over all
> > > fitness at about 6'4"...
>
> > > Verdasco has learned to hit hard WITH a margin AND take something off
> > > some shots to play not only some percentage tennis but also to keep
> > > the ball in play and working for angles/openings... THAT was so
> > > evident in his game yesterday... and yes he's FIT! All those backhand=
s
> > > he ran around and WITH BALANCE, able to twist pivot into the ball for
> > > explosivity... very good!
>
> > It will be interesting to see how Verdasco fares against Nadal if they
> > both reach the semifinal (though Tsonga is a major obstacle). Verdasco
> > has never beaten Nadal, and has lost to him on hard courts, clay, and
> > grass. Only the grass match was close, and of course Verdasco was
> > flattened by Nadal at Roland Garros last year. That defeat suggested
> > not only that Verdasco was a level below Nadal, but also that Verdasco
> > was quite intimidated by him, and thus unable to muster a really good
> > effort against his jefe. If Verdasco gets to play Nadal here, it won't
> > be enough merely to produce a sharply improved level of play -- he
> > will also have to break down his mental block. Maybe helping to win
> > the Davis Cup without Nadal has freed Verdasco to an extent.
>
> > Joe Ramirez
>
> Yep, good post.
> I feel that DC has helped a lot, and then came Gil.
> DC helped the brain, Reyes took care of the body... Quick &
> spectacular result!
> Verdasco is likely to become the Tsonga 2009; if he can win over the
> "real" JoWil !
> Too bad we have two Spain/France QF.
> Would have been a lot more "king of..." battles if Verdasco had to
> play Nadal & Simon had to play Tsonga!
> Not just a match, a match for taking the lead over your friends.
> Either weird (Monfils/Simon) or epic matches, yet always (since you
> are from one involved country!) interesting!
>
> Share & Enjoy,
> Manolo

So, there will be a "king of Spain" match :-)
Spain 2 / France 0
Predictable result, yet two good matches.
Verdasco is really on fire...
what he was the 09Tsonga for good?
Nadal better take care, you totally forgot about last year's SF!

Share & Enjoy,
Manolo


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 14:36:18
From: xamigax@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 18:46, Joe Ramirez <josephmrami...@netzero.com > wrote:
> On Jan 26, 12:18=A0pm, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 26, 7:54=A0am, "Vari L. Cinicke" <cini...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
> > > Sakari Lund wrote:
> > > > On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> > > > <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > > >> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > >>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
> > > >> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always =
a
> > > >> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so =
far
> > > >> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movem=
ent
> > > >> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > > > Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
> > > > time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> > > > silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> > > > I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and post=
ed
> > > > about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> > > > picked him for the final.
>
> > > > But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>
> > > Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and hi=
s
> > > work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.
>
> > > This is another milestone for him.
>
> > > Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Imag=
ine
> > > how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.
>
> > > --
> > > Cheers,
>
> > > vc
>
> > ++ He was running down some wide outs that were just a waste of
> > energy... I doubt Murray has another level of cardio capacity... he's
> > 6'3"... he's a big guy... only so much capacity given height-weight
> > ratios... the BIG guy phenomena begins to factor in to over all
> > fitness at about 6'4"...
>
> > Verdasco has learned to hit hard WITH a margin AND take something off
> > some shots to play not only some percentage tennis but also to keep
> > the ball in play and working for angles/openings... THAT was so
> > evident in his game yesterday... and yes he's FIT! All those backhands
> > he ran around and WITH BALANCE, able to twist pivot into the ball for
> > explosivity... very good!
>
> It will be interesting to see how Verdasco fares against Nadal if they
> both reach the semifinal (though Tsonga is a major obstacle). Verdasco
> has never beaten Nadal, and has lost to him on hard courts, clay, and
> grass. Only the grass match was close, and of course Verdasco was
> flattened by Nadal at Roland Garros last year. That defeat suggested
> not only that Verdasco was a level below Nadal, but also that Verdasco
> was quite intimidated by him, and thus unable to muster a really good
> effort against his jefe. If Verdasco gets to play Nadal here, it won't
> be enough merely to produce a sharply improved level of play -- he
> will also have to break down his mental block. Maybe helping to win
> the Davis Cup without Nadal has freed Verdasco to an extent.
>
> Joe Ramirez

Yep, good post.
I feel that DC has helped a lot, and then came Gil.
DC helped the brain, Reyes took care of the body... Quick &
spectacular result!
Verdasco is likely to become the Tsonga 2009; if he can win over the
"real" JoWil !
Too bad we have two Spain/France QF.
Would have been a lot more "king of..." battles if Verdasco had to
play Nadal & Simon had to play Tsonga!
Not just a match, a match for taking the lead over your friends.
Either weird (Monfils/Simon) or epic matches, yet always (since you
are from one involved country!) interesting!

Share & Enjoy,
Manolo


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 12:50:13
From: Wayne
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 Jan, 15:46, Sakari Lund <sakari.l...@welho.com > wrote:

> I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
> about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> picked him for the final.

I still think Murray will win a slam before too long. He's certainly
got the game to do it, just needs to cut down on the spells where he
becomes too passive and just pushes the ball back. His loss to
Verdasco was more of a setback rather than a career-defining
catastrophe. Although I do think it shows that putting him in with the
other 3 as one of the "big four" was a bit premature. But his time
will come.




 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 09:46:58
From: Joe Ramirez
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 12:18=A0pm, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net > wrote:
> On Jan 26, 7:54=A0am, "Vari L. Cinicke" <cini...@netscape.net> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Sakari Lund wrote:
> > > On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> > > <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > >> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
> > >> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> > >> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so fa=
r
> > >> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movemen=
t
> > >> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > > Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
> > > time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> > > silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> > > I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
> > > about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> > > picked him for the final.
>
> > > But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>
> > Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and his
> > work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.
>
> > This is another milestone for him.
>
> > Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Imagin=
e
> > how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.
>
> > --
> > Cheers,
>
> > vc
>
> ++ He was running down some wide outs that were just a waste of
> energy... I doubt Murray has another level of cardio capacity... he's
> 6'3"... he's a big guy... only so much capacity given height-weight
> ratios... the BIG guy phenomena begins to factor in to over all
> fitness at about 6'4"...
>
> Verdasco has learned to hit hard WITH a margin AND take something off
> some shots to play not only some percentage tennis but also to keep
> the ball in play and working for angles/openings... THAT was so
> evident in his game yesterday... and yes he's FIT! All those backhands
> he ran around and WITH BALANCE, able to twist pivot into the ball for
> explosivity... very good!

It will be interesting to see how Verdasco fares against Nadal if they
both reach the semifinal (though Tsonga is a major obstacle). Verdasco
has never beaten Nadal, and has lost to him on hard courts, clay, and
grass. Only the grass match was close, and of course Verdasco was
flattened by Nadal at Roland Garros last year. That defeat suggested
not only that Verdasco was a level below Nadal, but also that Verdasco
was quite intimidated by him, and thus unable to muster a really good
effort against his jefe. If Verdasco gets to play Nadal here, it won't
be enough merely to produce a sharply improved level of play -- he
will also have to break down his mental block. Maybe helping to win
the Davis Cup without Nadal has freed Verdasco to an extent.

Joe Ramirez


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 09:18:34
From: Patrick Kehoe
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 7:54=A0am, "Vari L. Cinicke" <cini...@netscape.net > wrote:
> Sakari Lund wrote:
> > On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> > <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> >> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
> >> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> >> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> >> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> >> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
> > time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> > silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> > I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
> > about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> > picked him for the final.
>
> > But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>
> Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and his
> work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.
>
> This is another milestone for him.
>
> Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Imagine
> how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.
>
> --
> Cheers,
>
> vc

++ He was running down some wide outs that were just a waste of
energy... I doubt Murray has another level of cardio capacity... he's
6'3"... he's a big guy... only so much capacity given height-weight
ratios... the BIG guy phenomena begins to factor in to over all
fitness at about 6'4"...

Verdasco has learned to hit hard WITH a margin AND take something off
some shots to play not only some percentage tennis but also to keep
the ball in play and working for angles/openings... THAT was so
evident in his game yesterday... and yes he's FIT! All those backhands
he ran around and WITH BALANCE, able to twist pivot into the ball for
explosivity... very good!

P



  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 18:37:10
From: Petter Solbu
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Patrick Kehoe wrote:

> Verdasco has learned to hit hard WITH a margin AND take something off
> some shots to play not only some percentage tennis but also to keep
> the ball in play and working for angles/openings... THAT was so
> evident in his game yesterday... and yes he's FIT! All those backhands
> he ran around and WITH BALANCE, able to twist pivot into the ball for
> explosivity... very good!

Actually, he reminded me a little bit of Nadal in that match. A little
flatter forehands, but still amazing spin and power.

PS.


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 03:47:23
From: xamigax@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 12:03, Whisper <beaver...@ozemail.com.au > wrote:
> xami...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
> > last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
> > significant",
>
> Disagree. =A0Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat
> Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.

You misread my word: I didn't say that Djokovic was not at his best HC
level.
Dare you say that Federer was even near his best HC level?

Come on!
5x in a row USOpen winner.
What can better define HC GOAT?

Share & Enjoy,
Manolo


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 03:44:56
From: xamigax@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 12:03, Whisper <beaver...@ozemail.com.au > wrote:
> xami...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
> > last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
> > significant",
>
> Disagree. =A0Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat
> Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.
>
> > and the final Nole played is adding sense to my point:
> > Tsonga was close to get it into a 5 setter... He wasn't outplayed at
> > all, Nole used wisely his better experience.
>
> > Share & Enjoy,
> > Manolo
>
> Agreed. =A0Tsonga woulda won if it went 5 as Djoke was sucking air big
> time - inexperience cost him, but it was still very close match.
>
> Rafa v Tsonga this yr could be a ripper of a match. =A0Tsonga will have a
> lot more pressure on him given last yr's performance, & Rafa will be
> hellbent on revenge.

Yep, absolutly right: Rafa wants a revenge for his total humiliation
last year.
What I disagree is thtat "pressure" on Tsonga, I can hardly remember
of someone so calm about it.
Jo has a huge amount of points to loose, not speaking of "pair
consideration" if he had been beaten in early rounds.
His won over Blake today showed once more how focused he is: he wants
that AO.
He feels at home, down-under.
The way he handles pressure reminds me a lot of Noah: he enjoys it, he
did not frustrate himself because of it.
From now on, I will be very surprised if Tsonga wasn't to do as well
as last year.
It will take something special to take him out of this AO.
I don't want anyone to take my words for granted, it's just a feeling
I have, match after match it's becoming more obvious, Tsonga believes
he can win this slam. And he wants to.

Here's my own "stamina wast'o meter":
Simon, Nadal, Tsonga =3D zero mistake so far.
Roddick =3D few lost
Federer =3D was tested once for real, passed that one.
Djokovic =3D easily irritated (no only in the press room), Marcos had
him to fight... I have no clear opinion, can he handle the pressure of
keeping his crown?
Verdasco =3D might have been on fire too soon, but couldn't skip: would
have lost to Murray!
Del Potro =3D few nervous signs, on different matches, kid is still
learning

More words about both Verdasco & Del Potro.
What a difference since their DC close encounter!
Del Potro lost his "kid on fire" stamp in my eyes... Verdasco took
that sticker from him.
JM was being regarded as the one with who a DC victory was highly
possible...
And Nando ended up with the better version "the one who had given a
decisive point for DC victory"!

DC gave Verdasco a huge boost, it's so clear now.
I think he understood how to manage emotions on big occasion, he does
look afraid of anybody, and beat the most hyped player since the last
USOpen. The one that has no defeat in 09....
I a much more impressed by Verdasco's results, than I had been from
Del Potro.

Don't know if the DC magic will last long, or if he really grew up
during his final...
Second lefty to give Federer nightmares soon?

Tennis is so much more enjoyable than it was ten years ago.
The field has hardly been filled with that many "high potential"
players, need to look back to the golden era of the mid 70's to late
80's.

The last 8 are looking so good:
13x slammer + 5x slammer + 1x slammer + 1x slammer + 1xSlam Finalist.

There has never been in the entire History of tennis anything close to
such "armada".
Please someone (I have to go to eat!) has to check how many slam
finalists that is.
Roddick + Federer + Nadal lost (and best part: Federer beeing the one
responsible for both losts!)

It will not automatically add prestige to the one that will hold the
trophy, that prestige is only coming from matches. You can hardly know
how a victory (not particularily Slam) comes... I remember how
disappointed I was after Edberg retired (with a better reason than
Henin), can't give any credit to the winner for that match (only for
having made his way 'til the final).


Share & Enjoy,
Manolo


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 03:23:44
From: Jason Catlin
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 6:17=A0am, Whisper <beaver...@ozemail.com.au > wrote:
> Stapler wrote:
> > "Whisper" <beaver...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
> >news:497d988f$0$14856$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> >> xami...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> >>> On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
> >>> last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
> >>> significant",
>
> >> Disagree. =A0Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly be=
at
> >> Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.
>
> > He beat monoFed plain and simple. Even you can't be that dumb as to say
> > otherwise.
>
> Did Fed have mono in 2007 USO final when Djoker blew 6 set points in 1st
> 2 sets, or did he just match Fed & lose them due to inexperience? =A0You
> do realize Fed is 6 yrs older than Djoker & 5 yrs older than Rafa & has
> huge experience advantage right?
>
> Probably not - Fedfucking stunts brain growth.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I'd say no experience edge over Rafa. He really shouldn't have much of
one over Djoke either, but Djoke's
one of these types who still has a junior mentality. He can't remain
calm on court even when he's up two breaks
in a set. Always screaming, throwing the racquet, looking at his
entourage. Tsonga's sort of that way as well so
no surprise Fed and Rafa are the ones grabbing all the titles.
Hopefully Murray can regroup and join them this year.


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 03:13:05
From: Jason Catlin
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 5:57=A0am, Whisper <beaver...@ozemail.com.au > wrote:
> kaennorsing wrote:
> > On 26 jan, 10:55, Jason Catlin <jason-cat...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Jan 26, 3:12 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
> >>>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
> >>>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> >>>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so fa=
r
> >>>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movemen=
t
> >>>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
> >>>> P
> >>> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray wa=
s
> >>> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> >>> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> >>> comments can be put in perspective now.
> >> No consideration?
>
> >>http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c79..=
.
>
> > Well, little consideration then. There certainly was an overall
> > consensus in the media as well as here on this group. Shows how people
> > love to jump on the bandwagon.
>
> I tipped Rafa v Fed final.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

But did anyone predict Murray to lose to Verdasco?


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 22:14:35
From: Whisper
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Jason Catlin wrote:
> On Jan 26, 5:57 am, Whisper <beaver...@ozemail.com.au> wrote:
>> kaennorsing wrote:
>>> On 26 jan, 10:55, Jason Catlin <jason-cat...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Jan 26, 3:12 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>>>>>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>>>>>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>>>>>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>>>>>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>>>>>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>>>>>> P
>>>>> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
>>>>> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
>>>>> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
>>>>> comments can be put in perspective now.
>>>> No consideration?
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c79...
>>> Well, little consideration then. There certainly was an overall
>>> consensus in the media as well as here on this group. Shows how people
>>> love to jump on the bandwagon.
>> I tipped Rafa v Fed final.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> But did anyone predict Murray to lose to Verdasco?



That was unlikely but not impossible.


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 02:52:18
From: xamigax@gmail.com
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 10:37, Petter Solbu <pettermann1...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> kaennorsing wrote:
> > I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> > gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> > was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> > comments can be put in perspective now.
>
> Federer's comments were appropriate, but Djokovic's tough talk about
> rankings is silly anyway.
>
> PS.

I have to agree, only Federer had some reflexions to give weight to
his point of view.
Djokovic was irritated because the question was simply ignoring their
ranking.
He didn't backed up his comment with slams results, and was it takes
to win 7 potential 5 setters.
Federer is so right talking about "mind", for there's no question -in
my mind- about Murray fitness to handle such matches... Was count is
how being down a set or two is demanding to the concentration, the
mind, the will of anyone.
Not even talking of the will of your own opponent to win the match as
well.

Federer knows how to play "relaxed", wich is so much more efficient.

Murray clearly is a slam contender, he wouldn't have reach USO Final,
and beat the big 3.
Only in tune-up (or MS, wich are another level of their own) so far.
So, Andy is still a student at slam, a good one, if not brilliant; but
yet without the victory that sttles you as slam winner.

To put thing in perspective, I'll add few words to the Murray/Djoker
match:
so far Djoker had done better than Andy: 2 slam F in a row, 50%
victory.
At the end of 2007 Nole was in a position so close to Andy's 2008:
high hopes, and one clean & quick lost to Federer at the USO...
Since age is a non-linear factor, I'll rate Federer's won over higher
than than his win over Novak.
Whisper's version: Djoker choked less than Murray :-)
On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
significant", and the final Nole played is adding sense to my point:
Tsonga was close to get it into a 5 setter... He wasn't outplayed at
all, Nole used wisely his better experience.

Share & Enjoy,
Manolo


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 22:03:43
From: Whisper
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
xamigax@gmail.com wrote:


> On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
> last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
> significant",


Disagree. Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat
Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.



> and the final Nole played is adding sense to my point:
> Tsonga was close to get it into a 5 setter... He wasn't outplayed at
> all, Nole used wisely his better experience.
>
> Share & Enjoy,
> Manolo




Agreed. Tsonga woulda won if it went 5 as Djoke was sucking air big
time - inexperience cost him, but it was still very close match.

Rafa v Tsonga this yr could be a ripper of a match. Tsonga will have a
lot more pressure on him given last yr's performance, & Rafa will be
hellbent on revenge.



   
Date: 26 Jan 2009 11:13:56
From: Stapler
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
"Whisper" <beaver999@ozemail.com.au > wrote in message
news:497d988f$0$14856$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> xamigax@gmail.com wrote:
>
>
>> On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
>> last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
>> significant",
>
>
> Disagree. Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat Fed
> on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.
>


He beat monoFed plain and simple. Even you can't be that dumb as to say
otherwise.



    
Date: 26 Jan 2009 22:17:38
From: Whisper
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Stapler wrote:
> "Whisper" <beaver999@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
> news:497d988f$0$14856$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>> xamigax@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>> On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
>>> last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
>>> significant",
>>
>>
>> Disagree. Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat
>> Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.
>>
>
>
> He beat monoFed plain and simple. Even you can't be that dumb as to say
> otherwise.


Did Fed have mono in 2007 USO final when Djoker blew 6 set points in 1st
2 sets, or did he just match Fed & lose them due to inexperience? You
do realize Fed is 6 yrs older than Djoker & 5 yrs older than Rafa & has
huge experience advantage right?

Probably not - Fedfucking stunts brain growth.


     
Date: 26 Jan 2009 12:14:12
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 22:17:38 +1100, Whisper <beaver999@ozemail.com.au >
wrote:

>Stapler wrote:
>> "Whisper" <beaver999@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
>> news:497d988f$0$14856$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>>> xamigax@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> On the other hand, Federer was clearly not near his "autopilot" level
>>>> last year, so I'll say that Novak AO won over Federer as "not that
>>>> significant",
>>>
>>>
>>> Disagree. Djoke at his very best & high confidence can certainly beat
>>> Fed on HC, but yes it's hard to get into that state regularly.
>>>
>>
>>
>> He beat monoFed plain and simple. Even you can't be that dumb as to say
>> otherwise.
>
>
>Did Fed have mono in 2007 USO final when Djoker blew 6 set points in 1st
>2 sets, or did he just match Fed & lose them due to inexperience? You
>do realize Fed is 6 yrs older than Djoker & 5 yrs older than Rafa & has
>huge experience advantage right?
>
>Probably not - Fedfucking stunts brain growth.


14 slams cures Samprasficking too.


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 02:28:52
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 10:55, Jason Catlin <jason-cat...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 26, 3:12=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > > On Jan 26, 12:03=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
> > > ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> > > big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> > > out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> > > to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > > P
>
> > I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> > gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> > was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> > comments can be put in perspective now.
>
> No consideration?
>
> http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c79...

Well, little consideration then. There certainly was an overall
consensus in the media as well as here on this group. Shows how people
love to jump on the bandwagon.


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 21:57:20
From: Whisper
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
kaennorsing wrote:
> On 26 jan, 10:55, Jason Catlin <jason-cat...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 26, 3:12 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>>>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>>>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>>>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>>>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>>>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>>>> P
>>> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
>>> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
>>> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
>>> comments can be put in perspective now.
>> No consideration?
>>
>> http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c79...
>
> Well, little consideration then. There certainly was an overall
> consensus in the media as well as here on this group. Shows how people
> love to jump on the bandwagon.


I tipped Rafa v Fed final.



  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 10:33:39
From: Stapler
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
"kaennorsing" <ljubitsis@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:5f83101b-2dd3-496a-90be-563f27493423@r36g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>>>Well, little consideration then. There certainly was an overall
consensus in the media as well as here on this group. Shows how people
love to jump on the bandwagon.<<<

I was not on the bandwagon. I simply said with all the media hype he had no
excuses to lose. I had no worries because Fed had blasted him in the US Open
final.



 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 01:55:16
From: Jason Catlin
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 3:12=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > On Jan 26, 12:03=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
> > ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> > big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> > out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> > to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > P
>
> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> comments can be put in perspective now.

No consideration?

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c79233778=
6d60321/ab4bec59c6cb3d1b?hl=3Den&lnk=3Dgst&q=3Dtough+Murray#ab4bec59c6cb3d1=
b


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 10:04:22
From: Stapler
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
"Jason Catlin" <jason-catlin@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:3c937b31-1899-42dc-b109-c2511f9da69a@t3g2000yqa.googlegroups.com...
>>>No consideration?

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.sport.tennis/browse_frm/thread/c792337786d60321/ab4bec59c6cb3d1b?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=tough+Murray#ab4bec59c6cb3d1b<<<<


Hehe. I am vindicated!



 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 00:20:28
From: Patrick Kehoe
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 12:12=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>
> > On Jan 26, 12:03=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
> > ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> > big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> > out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> > to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> > P
>
> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> comments can be put in perspective now.

++ Definately... Fed was right... he knows a bit about the gulf
between winning on tour, holding excellent form into a major and then
actually getting a slam win after two weeks of potentially 5 set
matches... big difference... Novak said the same thing, essentially...
didn't like being relegated so soon, with no evidence, no dominating
results in a slam from the talented Murray...

P


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 00:12:19
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net > wrote:
> On Jan 26, 12:03=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> P

I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
comments can be put in perspective now.


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 20:04:52
From: TT
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
kaennorsing wrote:
> On 26 jan, 09:07, Patrick Kehoe <pke...@telus.net> wrote:
>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>>
>> P
>
> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> comments can be put in perspective now.

Did you believe the hype? I didn't. Never believed Murray would beat
Nadal in the semi.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 10:37:35
From: Petter Solbu
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
kaennorsing wrote:

> I just thought it was funny how it was presented as a given Murray was
> gonna win his first slam here. No consideration of the pressure that
> was going to be on his shoulders. I think the Federer and Djokovic
> comments can be put in perspective now.

Federer's comments were appropriate, but Djokovic's tough talk about
rankings is silly anyway.

PS.


 
Date: 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57
From: Patrick Kehoe
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Jan 26, 12:03=A0am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL

++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
to run around his backhand was AMAZING...

P



  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 17:46:16
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
<pkehoe@telus.net > wrote:

>On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
>++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>to run around his backhand was AMAZING...

Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
silly errors, just played very well until the end.

I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
picked him for the final.

But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.





   
Date: 26 Jan 2009 20:05:45
From: TT
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Sakari Lund wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> <pkehoe@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
> time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
> about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> picked him for the final.

Who did you pick to win?

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


   
Date: 26 Jan 2009 15:54:40
From: Vari L. Cinicke
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Sakari Lund wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
> <pkehoe@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
> time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
> silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>
> I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
> about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
> picked him for the final.
>
> But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>
>
>

Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and his
work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.

This is another milestone for him.

Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Imagine
how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.

--
Cheers,

vc


    
Date: 26 Jan 2009 16:04:44
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 15:54:40 GMT, "Vari L. Cinicke"
<cinicke@netscape.net > wrote:

>Sakari Lund wrote:
>> On Mon, 26 Jan 2009 00:07:57 -0800 (PST), Patrick Kehoe
>> <pkehoe@telus.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>>> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
>>> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
>>> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
>>> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>>
>> Verdasco has always had big shots, but this was probably the first
>> time he kept it together in such a big match, didn't start making
>> silly errors, just played very well until the end.
>>
>> I always had a feeling Murray wasn't going to win this AO, and posted
>> about it. But I didn't expect him to lose this early. In fact, I
>> picked him for the final.
>>
>> But yes, wining a slam is different than winning Abu Dhabi exo.
>>
>>
>>
>
>Verdasco used to be a great big waste of talent. The Davis Cup and his
>work with Gil Reyes seem to have made a believer out of him.
>
>This is another milestone for him.
>
>Murray's fitness is still not where he thinks it is, it appears. Imagine
>how he might have been on a much hotter day in the sun.


UGLY !


  
Date: 26 Jan 2009 13:52:40
From: TT
Subject: Re: Guess slams are a little different after all
Patrick Kehoe wrote:
> On Jan 26, 12:03 am, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> Murray favourite for this AO? LOL
>
> ++ It did take an amazing performace to put him out that's always a
> big indicator though... Verdasco played the match of his life, so far
> out there... monster hitting, some good serving runs and his movement
> to run around his backhand was AMAZING...
>
> P
>

Yes, that was best match Verdasco ever played, or at least what I've
seen. And he didn't even fucking choke which has been his problem in the
past.

Must be love. :)

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"