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Date: 31 Jan 2009 11:06:33
From: akamai
Subject: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
record is really interesting!

Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
badly.
Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
tight match.
Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
badly.
Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
tight match.
Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
a win.

He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.

In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
is never do or die for him.

Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 14:54:37
From: The MAN
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 12:59=A0pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 31, 1:06=A0pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes ou=
t
> > > a win.
>
> > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down th=
e
> > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed t=
o
> > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and th=
e
> > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit h=
e
> > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > pressure...
>
> Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> somewhere.
>
> Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> psychology by Nadal.
>
> Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
> see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> certain to ignite Federer.
>
> We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
> lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> him.


You think Rafa went to 5 sets on purpose, to
appear the underdog?

LOL! No way!

He was way exhausted, and that will work for Feddy.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:53:04
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On 31 jan, 22:48, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr > wrote:
> "kaennorsing" <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:7c96ed35-36fb-4cdc-b296-de4f9299f0f9@35g2000pry.googlegroups.com...
> On 31 jan, 22:14, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr> wrote:
>
> > "kaennorsing" <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> > Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
> > some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish
> > the
> > "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>
> Some = #skripting, TTroll, Groundass, Whimper, arancid, etc.
>
> ***
>
> It's * not #.

I know ;-)


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:49:56
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On 31 jan, 22:15, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses i=
n a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses i=
n a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes =
out
> > > > a win.
>
> > > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down =
the
> > > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelmin=
g
> > > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed=
to
> > > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden =
of
> > > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. =
We
> > > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If =
he
> > > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. I=
t
> > > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to s=
ee
> > > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cann=
ot
> > > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and =
the
> > > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit=
he
> > > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > > pressure...
>
> > Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> > somewhere.
>
> > Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> > akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> > rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> > pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> > good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> > managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> > when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> > counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> > psychology by Nadal.
>
> > Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
> > see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> > weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> > certain to ignite Federer.
>
> > We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> > once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> > uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
> > lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> > reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> > this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> > him.
>
> You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
> GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
> favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
> challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
> Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
> to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.

It fires him up to be underdog. Nothing necessarily wrong with that.
It works well for most people. It would be nice though for him to
admit he's favourite over Federer, at least once, so we can see how
that goes. :)

> I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
> to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
> player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
> matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
> fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
> Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.

Eventhough Federer (arguably) played the tougher hardcourt players;
Roddick, Del Potro, Berdych, Safin, Korolev and Seppi > Verdasco,
Simon, Gonzalez, Haas, Karanusic and Rochus

If the draw was reversed the usual trolls would be screaming bloody
murder and Nadal would have likely played a gruelling five setter
against Roddick too.


  
Date: 01 Feb 2009 00:03:01
From: TT
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
kaennorsing wrote:
> On 31 jan, 22:15, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>> On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
>>>>> record is really interesting!
>>>>> Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
>>>>> badly.
>>>>> Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
>>>>> tight match.
>>>>> Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
>>>>> badly.
>>>>> Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
>>>>> tight match.
>>>>> Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
>>>>> a win.
>>>>> He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
>>>>> other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>>>>> In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
>>>>> favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
>>>>> set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
>>>>> grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
>>>>> being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
>>>>> all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
>>>>> loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
>>>>> young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
>>>>> is never do or die for him.
>>>>> Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
>>>>> how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
>>>>> really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
>>>>> other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
>>>>> fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
>>>>> is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>>>> It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
>>>> squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
>>>> the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
>>>> wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
>>>> GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
>>>> pressure...
>>> Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
>>> somewhere.
>>> Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
>>> akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
>>> rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
>>> pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
>>> good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
>>> managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
>>> when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
>>> counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
>>> psychology by Nadal.
>>> Now that they switched ranking positions itīs become interesting to
>>> see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
>>> weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
>>> certain to ignite Federer.
>>> We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
>>> once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
>>> uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesnīt want to
>>> lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
>>> reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
>>> this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
>>> him.
>> You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
>> GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
>> favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
>> challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
>> Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
>> to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.
>
> It fires him up to be underdog. Nothing necessarily wrong with that.
> It works well for most people. It would be nice though for him to
> admit he's favourite over Federer, at least once, so we can see how
> that goes. :)
>
>> I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
>> to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
>> player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
>> matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
>> fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
>> Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.
>
> Eventhough Federer (arguably) played the tougher hardcourt players;
> Roddick, Del Potro, Berdych, Safin, Korolev and Seppi > Verdasco,
> Simon, Gonzalez, Haas, Karanusic and Rochus
>
> If the draw was reversed the usual trolls would be screaming bloody
> murder and Nadal would have likely played a gruelling five setter
> against Roddick too.

Ypu can't play a gruelling match against Roddick. Not with Nadal's
groundstrokes.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 22:52:41
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk

"kaennorsing" <ljubitsis@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:d3d66b32-72d8-4150-a5ec-4d15d26fd99d@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On 31 jan, 22:15, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in
> > > > a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in
> > > > a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes
> > > > out
> > > > a win.
>
> > > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down
> > > > the
> > > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed
> > > > to
> > > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden
> > > > of
> > > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal.
> > > > We
> > > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If
> > > > he
> > > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to
> > > > see
> > > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he
> > > > cannot
> > > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and
> > > > the
> > > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit
> > > > he
> > > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > > pressure...
>
> > Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> > somewhere.
>
> > Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> > akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> > rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> > pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> > good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> > managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> > when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> > counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> > psychology by Nadal.
>
> > Now that they switched ranking positions itīs become interesting to
> > see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> > weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> > certain to ignite Federer.
>
> > We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> > once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> > uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesnīt want to
> > lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> > reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> > this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> > him.
>
> You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
> GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
> favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
> challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
> Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
> to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.

It fires him up to be underdog. Nothing necessarily wrong with that.
It works well for most people. It would be nice though for him to
admit he's favourite over Federer, at least once, so we can see how
that goes. :)

> I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
> to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
> player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
> matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
> fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
> Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.

Eventhough Federer (arguably) played the tougher hardcourt players;
Roddick, Del Potro, Berdych, Safin, Korolev and Seppi > Verdasco,
Simon, Gonzalez, Haas, Karanusic and Rochus

If the draw was reversed the usual trolls would be screaming bloody
murder and Nadal would have likely played a gruelling five setter
against Roddick too.

***

no coulda/woulda allowed in serious analysis.




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:33:34
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 3:31=A0pm, Sakari Lund <sakari.l...@welho.com > wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 13:20:52 -0800 (PST), RahimAsif
>
> <RahimA...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >On Jan 31, 3:14=A0pm, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr> wrote:
> >> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge eg=
o,
> >> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinqui=
sh the
> >> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>
> >> Remember how he was pissed off then media =A0and the bookmakers starte=
d hyping
>
> >Turns out Fed was right. He said him and Rafa were the favorites, then
> >Djokovic and then Murray. Him and Rafa are in the finals, Djoke went
> >out in the QF and Murray in the 4th. Astute student of the game, that
> >Federer...
>
> If he said he and Rafa were the favourites, then Verdasco and Roddick,
> that would have been impressive =A0:-)

He said Verdasco could be a factor IIRC after beating him barely at
Kooyong...


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 23:40:00
From: TT
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
RahimAsif wrote:
> On Jan 31, 3:31 pm, Sakari Lund <sakari.l...@welho.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 13:20:52 -0800 (PST), RahimAsif
>>
>> <RahimA...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Jan 31, 3:14 pm, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr> wrote:
>>>> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
>>>> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish the
>>>> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>>>> Remember how he was pissed off then media and the bookmakers started hyping
>>> Turns out Fed was right. He said him and Rafa were the favorites, then
>>> Djokovic and then Murray. Him and Rafa are in the finals, Djoke went
>>> out in the QF and Murray in the 4th. Astute student of the game, that
>>> Federer...
>> If he said he and Rafa were the favourites, then Verdasco and Roddick,
>> that would have been impressive :-)
>
> He said Verdasco could be a factor IIRC after beating him barely at
> Kooyong...

Nadal vs. Verdasco was the moral final. Same as Nadal vs. Djokovic at FO.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:31:32
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On 31 jan, 22:14, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr > wrote:
> "kaennorsing" <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish =
the
> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.

Some =3D #skripting, TTroll, Groundass, Whimper, arancid, etc.

> Remember how he was pissed off then media =A0and the bookmakers started h=
yping
> Murray for this AO etc. Djokovic is pretty much the same.

He was surprised, not pissed off. That's your invention. Besides, if
getting pissed off gets him to another slam final/title it can't be
that bad, right? Since slams are all that matter?

> Rafa's mind and personality are truly awesome. So determined, focused,
> hungry for success, but aparantley without any ego-problems..

No argument.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 22:48:20
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk

"kaennorsing" <ljubitsis@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:7c96ed35-36fb-4cdc-b296-de4f9299f0f9@35g2000pry.googlegroups.com...
On 31 jan, 22:14, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr > wrote:
> "kaennorsing" <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish
> the
> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.

Some = #skripting, TTroll, Groundass, Whimper, arancid, etc.

***


It's * not #.




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:24:23
From: akamai
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 3:14 pm, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr > wrote:
> "kaennorsing" <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:d30c145a-90d4-4b44-b0a0-f2e2b1ae080d@n33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
> On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes ou=
t
> > > a win.
>
> > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down th=
e
> > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed t=
o
> > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and th=
e
> > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit h=
e
> > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > pressure...
>
> Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> somewhere.
>
> Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> psychology by Nadal.
>
> Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
> see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> certain to ignite Federer.
>
> We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
> lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> him.
>
> ***
>
> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish =
the
> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>
> Remember how he was pissed off then media and the bookmakers started hyp=
ing
> Murray for this AO etc. Djokovic is pretty much the same.
>
> Rafa's mind and personality are truly awesome. So determined, focused,
> hungry for success, but aparantley without any ego-problems..

Yes, Fed has a huge ego and that has served well and served him ill.
He has a big ego too, otherwise he cannot succeed at that level. But
my point is Nadal does not want the burden of the favourite tag. Even
last year he was saying that since Federer was #1, he should be
considered the favourite. Now, he is saying "it is just a number and
it does not change the equation much". What the heck! He is the #1 by
a mile at this point, his attempts at modesty sound just hollow to me.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:20:52
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 3:14=A0pm, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr > wrote:
> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish =
the
> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>
> Remember how he was pissed off then media =A0and the bookmakers started h=
yping

Turns out Fed was right. He said him and Rafa were the favorites, then
Djokovic and then Murray. Him and Rafa are in the finals, Djoke went
out in the QF and Murray in the 4th. Astute student of the game, that
Federer...



  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 23:31:14
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 13:20:52 -0800 (PST), RahimAsif
<RahimAsif@gmail.com > wrote:

>On Jan 31, 3:14 pm, "*skriptis" <skrip...@post.t-com.hr> wrote:
>> Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
>> some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish the
>> "favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.
>>
>> Remember how he was pissed off then media  and the bookmakers started hyping
>
>Turns out Fed was right. He said him and Rafa were the favorites, then
>Djokovic and then Murray. Him and Rafa are in the finals, Djoke went
>out in the QF and Murray in the 4th. Astute student of the game, that
>Federer...

If he said he and Rafa were the favourites, then Verdasco and Roddick,
that would have been impressive :-)


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:17:42
From: akamai
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 3:15 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses i=
n a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > > badly.
> > > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses i=
n a
> > > > tight match.
> > > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes =
out
> > > > a win.
>
> > > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down =
the
> > > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelmin=
g
> > > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed=
to
> > > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden =
of
> > > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. =
We
> > > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If =
he
> > > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. I=
t
> > > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to s=
ee
> > > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cann=
ot
> > > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and =
the
> > > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit=
he
> > > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > > pressure...
>
> > Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> > somewhere.
>
> > Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> > akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> > rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> > pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> > good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> > managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> > when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> > counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> > psychology by Nadal.
>
> > Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
> > see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> > weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> > certain to ignite Federer.
>
> > We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> > once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> > uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
> > lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> > reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> > this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> > him.
>
> You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
> GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
> favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
> challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
> Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
> to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.
>
> I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
> to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
> player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
> matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
> fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
> Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.

Correction on the last part of the last sentence ...
"and why glorify Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling
match?"


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:15:27
From: akamai
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in =
a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes ou=
t
> > > a win.
>
> > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down th=
e
> > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed t=
o
> > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and th=
e
> > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit h=
e
> > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > pressure...
>
> Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> somewhere.
>
> Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> psychology by Nadal.
>
> Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
> see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> certain to ignite Federer.
>
> We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
> lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> him.

You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.

I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 22:45:53
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk

"akamai" <akamai.nakuma@gmail.com > wrote in message
news:46d94689-96cc-4179-b395-8097e8640f2b@e22g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
On Jan 31, 2:59 pm, kaennorsing <ljubit...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > > record is really interesting!
>
> > > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > > badly.
> > > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > > tight match.
> > > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
> > > a win.
>
> > > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
> > > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
> > > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > > is never do or die for him.
>
> > > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
> > > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
> > > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> > It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> > squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> > the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> > wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> > GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> > pressure...
>
> Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
> somewhere.
>
> Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
> akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
> rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
> pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
> good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
> managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
> when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
> counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
> psychology by Nadal.
>
> Now that they switched ranking positions itīs become interesting to
> see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
> weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
> certain to ignite Federer.
>
> We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
> once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
> uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesnīt want to
> lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
> reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
> this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
> him.

You spoke my mind. For a guy everybody proclaiming to be the next
GOAT, I find it really funny for him to keep denying he is the
favourite. I want the #1 player in the world to man up to the
challenges of being #1. Right there, I see signs that he is still
Uncle Tony's little boy who wants to defy the world. He always wants
to be the antagonist:-) Kind of Hewitt mentality.

I also find it interesting that the media does not raise questions as
to why the runaway #1 takes more than 5hr 15min to beat a 15-ranked
player. The stupid media keeps harping on how easy Fed's last two
matches were whereas Nadal had to play the longest match. How can you
fault Federer making his matches easy for himself and why glorious
Nadal for making it such a physically gruelling match.


***

Stupid post.




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 12:59:41
From: kaennorsing
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 1:06=A0pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > record is really interesting!
>
> > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > badly.
> > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > tight match.
> > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > badly.
> > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > tight match.
> > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
> > a win.
>
> > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
> > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
> > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > is never do or die for him.
>
> > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
> > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
> > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> pressure...

Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
somewhere.

Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
psychology by Nadal.

Now that they switched ranking positions it=B4s become interesting to
see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
certain to ignite Federer.

We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesn=B4t want to
lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
him.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 22:14:03
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk

"kaennorsing" <ljubitsis@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:d30c145a-90d4-4b44-b0a0-f2e2b1ae080d@n33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
On 31 jan, 20:36, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 1:06 pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> > record is really interesting!
>
> > Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > badly.
> > Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > tight match.
> > Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> > badly.
> > Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> > tight match.
> > Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
> > a win.
>
> > He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
> > other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> > In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> > favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
> > set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> > grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> > being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> > all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> > loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> > young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> > is never do or die for him.
>
> > Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> > how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> > really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
> > other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> > fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
> > is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!
>
> It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
> squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
> the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
> wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
> GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
> pressure...

Nobody can handle any kind of pressure. There will be a breaking point
somewhere.

Although Nadal is one of the mentally strongest players out there,
akamai IMO has a good point. I often thought similarly about the
rivalry between these players. Nadal knows exactly how to keep the
pressure firmly on Federer's shoulders and most of the media does a
good job to help him out. Even last year before the FO final, Nadal
managed to manoeuvre himself out of that favourites position. Federer,
when becoming #1, seemed to revel that position and did little to
counter the increasing expectation and the continues deliberate
psychology by Nadal.

Now that they switched ranking positions itīs become interesting to
see if and how either players mentality changes. Especially how the
weight of expectation will play out on Nadal, since it's almost
certain to ignite Federer.

We already witnessed Rafa yesterday quickly using his long match to -
once again - anoint Federer as favourite. To me that says Nadal is
uncertain to be considered favourite over Federer. He doesnīt want to
lose his familiar mindset going into a match with Federer and is
reluctant to have the burden of expectation on his shoulders. He know
this will motivate Federer to a greater extent and takes pressure off
him.

***

Yes, it all goes down to the fact that Federer is a man with a huge ego,
some could say a stuborn egomaniac who is unable/unwilling to relinquish the
"favorite" label even if it would serve his purpose.

Remember how he was pissed off then media and the bookmakers started hyping
Murray for this AO etc. Djokovic is pretty much the same.


Rafa's mind and personality are truly awesome. So determined, focused,
hungry for success, but aparantley without any ego-problems..




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 22:43:30
From: TT
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
akamai wrote:
> In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> record is really interesting!
>
> Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> badly.
> Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> tight match.
> Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> badly.
> Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> tight match.
> Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
> a win.
>
> He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
> other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
> set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> is never do or die for him.
>
> Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
> other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
> is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!

Biased post with factual errors.

Nadal has been the favourite on their all clay meetings and surely had
pressure in Wimby 08 too, having lost the final 2 times before.

If you want to see how Nadal performs when he's the overwhelming
favourite - look at FO 2008.

Also, apart from yeasterday's match you list only Nadal's losing "big
matches" when he's the favourite.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 11:36:01
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: How will Nadal when there is no Fed talk
On Jan 31, 1:06=A0pm, akamai <akamai.nak...@gmail.com > wrote:
> In big matches out of clay where Nadal is the favourite, Nadal's
> record is really interesting!
>
> Against Gonzo in 07 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> badly.
> Against Ferrer in 07 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> tight match.
> Against Tsonga in 08 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses
> badly.
> Against Murray in 08 US Open, Nadal is the favourite and he loses in a
> tight match.
> Against FV in 09 AUS Open, Nadal is the favourite, 5 sets and ekes out
> a win.
>
> He plays defensive so much more not to lose and tries to wear down the
> other guy. That is why he has all these tight long matches.
>
> In almost all the matches against Fed, Fed has been the overwhelming
> favourite or as much as Nadal (on clay). People always expected Fed to
> set some kind of record (CYGS talk, consecutive Wimbledons, career
> grand slam talk, French and Wimbledon combo), Fed takes the burden of
> being the favourite. This seems to work really in favour of Nadal. We
> all know the h2h and it bears this out. Nadal can swing freely. If he
> loses, people will always say "Hey, Fed is the greatest, you are so
> young and you have time". If he wins, there is praise all around. It
> is never do or die for him.
>
> Whether or not he wins tomorrow, it will be really interesting to see
> how he performs when he is the overwhelming favourite which he cannot
> really refuse (when he is the #1, he is the defending champion and the
> other guy does not have any pressure) and the other guy swings for
> fences. There will be no hiding in Fed's shadow and he has to admit he
> is the guy to beat and go beat the other guys!

It won't bother him the slightest in my opinion. Anyone who could
squander a 2 set advantage (and 3 points to go up a decisive break in
the 3rd set) and come within 2 points of losing the tournament he
wanted to win all his life, and still manage to recover and beat a
GOAT candidate on his favorite surface can handle any kind of
pressure...