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Date: 31 Jan 2009 04:30:35
From:
Subject: If we take a big-picture look at this match
instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
(Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.


He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.

With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
stellar, plenty good enough
to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
the formula for success off of clay.

Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
that slight edges can make all
the difference at the highest level of sport.

Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
Rafa has just scraped his way to his
first hard court final

Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak

But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
of Fed on Sunday.





 
Date: 01 Feb 2009 13:55:30
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > Why would you try to s/v more with a 2- hander?
> > If ya don't got the grips...- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> I don't understand your point about the grips with regard to s/v.
> Continental grip on the serve, continental
> grip on the volley, no problem. I think I should employ the tactic
> more especially against players who like
> to slice the return on the backhand side. Might allow me to hold more
> easily in certain matches.

From what I've seen, most guys with 2-handers are not
comfortable with s/v, and with the Continental grip
in general, other than on the serve. ymmv.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 12:36:51
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 3:13=A0pm, RahimAsif <RahimA...@hotmail.com > wrote:
> On Jan 31, 10:17=A0am, jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > It was a tournament in some little town in Italy in 1985, when we were
> > both 14. He didn't have that great of a serve when he was that age so
> > I never coulda predicted he would have as great a career as he did.
> > I was/am a decent amateur player. Definitely had no illusions of being
> > a pro.
>
> I so wish you had won that round and faced Goran. He was my favorite
> player of all time. Basically, the first tennis match I ever saw was
> Goran against Chris Bailey at Wim in 1993. Goran was down match point
> and hit a 2nd serve ace (after his first attempt at 2nd serve
> miraculously crept over the net) and went on to win the match. Have
> been hooked to tennis ever since...

I can't say he was my favorite player. I guess I've always had more of
a fondness for the gritty grinder-types
without the huge weapons. Maybe I'm jealous because I never had
anything close to the huge weapons of people like Goran. But he did
seem like a really cool, down-to-earth guy, especially compared to
really cocky types like David Wheaton - and a few other Bolletierri
products I knew who went on to be pros - who could be real pricks back
in the day. Not Courier though. He was also a lot more of a regular
guy from my experience who would talk to everybody.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 12:13:50
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 10:17=A0am, jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> It was a tournament in some little town in Italy in 1985, when we were
> both 14. He didn't have that great of a serve when he was that age so
> I never coulda predicted he would have as great a career as he did.
> I was/am a decent amateur player. Definitely had no illusions of being
> a pro.

I so wish you had won that round and faced Goran. He was my favorite
player of all time. Basically, the first tennis match I ever saw was
Goran against Chris Bailey at Wim in 1993. Goran was down match point
and hit a 2nd serve ace (after his first attempt at 2nd serve
miraculously crept over the net) and went on to win the match. Have
been hooked to tennis ever since...


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 12:07:17
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 6:55=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > stellar, plenty good enough
> > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > that slight edges can make all
> > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > first hard court final
>
> > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." =A0Really now. A tough
> semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
> tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>
> Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.

Try to get a better hobby than linking everyone whose opinion you
disagree with to Whisper. Jason is easily one of the better posters in
RST...


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 12:03:11
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 8:42=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Jan 31, 8:19=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadi=
sm
> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on wi=
th
> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typical=
ly
> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we kn=
ow
> > > > that slight edges can make all
> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, wher=
eas
> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > > > first hard court final
>
> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head=
2
> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on =
a
> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in fav=
or
> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> > > If Catlin really played tennis, he was a runner with a
> > > two-hander. And no power. (Just a lucky guess)- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Actually, good guess! Yeah, I never thought of myself as a really
> > talented player.
>
> > I play pretty smart, play good D and don't beat myself, have a pretty
> > heavy forehand that bothers players 4.5 and below quite a lot. I do
> > have a 2-hander but I can't really hurt players with it much and
> > pretty much go cross-court 85% of the time, again with a fair amount
> > of top. I do have a good slice though and so I try to mix that in
> > quite a bit and go down the line with it to put people in
> > uncomfortable positions, since I don't have the ability to crack dtl
> > backhands for winners.
>
> > Along with my forehand, my serve is a fairly decent weapon for my
> > level. I usually hit between 5-10 aces a match. My volleys are decent
> > but I only serve-volley sparingly. Should do it more.
>
> Your game sounds like that of a good friend of mine,
> who was named SoCal coach of the year this year.
> Why would you try to s/v more with a 2- hander?
> If ya don't got the grips...- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I don't understand your point about the grips with regard to s/v.
Continental grip on the serve, continental
grip on the volley, no problem. I think I should employ the tactic
more especially against players who like
to slice the return on the backhand side. Might allow me to hold more
easily in certain matches.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 08:56:20
From: RahimAsif
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 6:30=A0am, jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> stellar, plenty good enough
> to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> the formula for success off of clay.
>
> Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> that slight edges can make all
> the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> first hard court final
>
> Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

If Rafa plays at the level he showed in the last two matches, the
match is definitely on Fed's strings. If he plays at the level he
showed against Haas and Gonzo, its on his rackets - since he can hit
just as many winners as Fed and far fewer UE and even fewer loose
service games and points. Unless of course, the Fed that showed up in
the semis and finals of the USO shows up, or the one that dominated
tennis between 2004-2006...


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 08:17:49
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 10:02=A0am, Sakari Lund <sakari.l...@welho.com > wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:32:08 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Jan 31, 8:26=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> > On Jan 31, 7:55=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or s=
adism
> >> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> >> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfac=
es.
>
> >> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> >> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
> >> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on=
with
> >> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> >> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typi=
cally
> >> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> >> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we=
know
> >> > > > that slight edges can make all
> >> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> >> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, w=
hereas
> >> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> >> > > > first hard court final
>
> >> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall h=
ead 2
> >> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced =
on a
> >> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> >> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in =
favor
> >> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> >> > > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." =A0Really now. A tough
> >> > > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
> >> > > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>
> >> > Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is ha=
rd
> >> > courts have been a big challenge
> >> > for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
> >> > final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
> >> > way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason f=
or
> >> > the animosity?
>
> >> > > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>
> >> > If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and hav=
e
> >> > posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.
>
> >> -Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
> >> France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
> >> *do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.- Hide quoted te=
xt -
>
> >> - Show quoted text -
>
> >Sure it does. I used to play at a higher level. Maybe 5.5. You don't
> >have to be a pro to be playing money
> >tournaments in France. I wasn't suggesting I was winning those
> >tournaments :), although my friend and I did win some doubles event
> >somewhere
>
> >As far as Ivanisevic, that was when I was in juniors. I lost to a guy
> >the round before I woulda played Goran. That was a funny story. He
> >went absolutely berserk after losing the first 4 games to the guy I
> >lost to, hit four straight returns over the fence. Then he came back
> >and won like 7-6, 6-0 and went on to win the tournament.
>
> I got curious and checked by the name Catlin from ITF database. All I
> found was Marissa Catlin. I found Ivanisevic junior matches from
> 1987-88. So I guess it was something else than ITF junior tournaments?- H=
ide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

It was a tournament in some little town in Italy in 1985, when we were
both 14. He didn't have that great of a serve when he was that age so
I never coulda predicted he would have as great a career as he did.
I was/am a decent amateur player. Definitely had no illusions of being
a pro.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 18:43:29
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 08:17:49 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
wrote:

>On Jan 31, 10:02 am, Sakari Lund <sakari.l...@welho.com> wrote:
>> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:32:08 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Jan 31, 8:26 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> > On Jan 31, 7:55 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>> >> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
>> >> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>>
>> >> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>>
>> >> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
>> >> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
>> >> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
>> >> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
>> >> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
>> >> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>>
>> >> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
>> >> > > > that slight edges can make all
>> >> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>>
>> >> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
>> >> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
>> >> > > > first hard court final
>>
>> >> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
>> >> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
>> >> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>>
>> >> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> >> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>>
>> >> > > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.."  Really now. A tough
>> >> > > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
>> >> > > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>>
>> >> > Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
>> >> > courts have been a big challenge
>> >> > for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
>> >> > final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
>> >> > way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
>> >> > the animosity?
>>
>> >> > > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>>
>> >> > If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
>> >> > posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.
>>
>> >> -Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
>> >> France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
>> >> *do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> >> - Show quoted text -
>>
>> >Sure it does. I used to play at a higher level. Maybe 5.5. You don't
>> >have to be a pro to be playing money
>> >tournaments in France. I wasn't suggesting I was winning those
>> >tournaments :), although my friend and I did win some doubles event
>> >somewhere
>>
>> >As far as Ivanisevic, that was when I was in juniors. I lost to a guy
>> >the round before I woulda played Goran. That was a funny story. He
>> >went absolutely berserk after losing the first 4 games to the guy I
>> >lost to, hit four straight returns over the fence. Then he came back
>> >and won like 7-6, 6-0 and went on to win the tournament.
>>
>> I got curious and checked by the name Catlin from ITF database. All I
>> found was Marissa Catlin. I found Ivanisevic junior matches from
>> 1987-88. So I guess it was something else than ITF junior tournaments?- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>It was a tournament in some little town in Italy in 1985, when we were
>both 14. He didn't have that great of a serve when he was that age so
>I never coulda predicted he would have as great a career as he did.

He got that serve pretty soon after that though. When he was 17 he was
a good player already with a big serve.

>I was/am a decent amateur player. Definitely had no illusions of being
>a pro.

It is interesting to read about rst posters connections with top
players. There have been other cases like that.




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 06:08:05
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 8:54=A0am, Dave Hazelwood <the_big_kah...@mailcity.com >
wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:12:55 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
> >On Jan 31, 7:58=A0am, TT <g...@Olympics.org> wrote:
> >> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> >> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadis=
m
> >> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> >> Sadism? Posts that say Nadal wins make you suffer that much? :)
>
> >Huh? Nadal's one of my favorite players.
>
> i can't imagine why ?

If it weren't for Nadal, Federer wouldn't have a job. Fans would
start watching badminton instead.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:42:53
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Jan 31, 8:19=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
> >
> > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
> >
> > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > > stellar, plenty good enough
> > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > > the formula for success off of clay.
> >
> > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > > that slight edges can make all
> > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
> >
> > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, wherea=
s
> > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > > first hard court final
> >
> > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
> >
> > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > > of Fed on Sunday.
> >
> > If Catlin really played tennis, he was a runner with a
> > two-hander. And no power. (Just a lucky guess)- Hide quoted text -
> >
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Actually, good guess! Yeah, I never thought of myself as a really
> talented player.
>
> I play pretty smart, play good D and don't beat myself, have a pretty
> heavy forehand that bothers players 4.5 and below quite a lot. I do
> have a 2-hander but I can't really hurt players with it much and
> pretty much go cross-court 85% of the time, again with a fair amount
> of top. I do have a good slice though and so I try to mix that in
> quite a bit and go down the line with it to put people in
> uncomfortable positions, since I don't have the ability to crack dtl
> backhands for winners.
>
> Along with my forehand, my serve is a fairly decent weapon for my
> level. I usually hit between 5-10 aces a match. My volleys are decent
> but I only serve-volley sparingly. Should do it more.

Your game sounds like that of a good friend of mine,
who was named SoCal coach of the year this year.
Why would you try to s/v more with a 2- hander?
If ya don't got the grips...


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:40:23
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 04:30:35 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
wrote:

>instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
>(Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
>
>He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
>With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
>stellar, plenty good enough
>to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
>big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
>player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
>the formula for success off of clay.
>
>Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
>that slight edges can make all
>the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
>Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
>Rafa has just scraped his way to his
>first hard court final
>
>Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
>head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
>hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
>But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>of Fed on Sunday.


I agree but I'd say it is more like 90/10 in Feds favor with the 10
being only because sometimes "shit happens".


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:32:08
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 8:26=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Jan 31, 7:55=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadi=
sm
> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on wi=
th
> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typical=
ly
> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we kn=
ow
> > > > that slight edges can make all
> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, wher=
eas
> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > > > first hard court final
>
> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head=
2
> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on =
a
> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in fav=
or
> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> > > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." =A0Really now. A tough
> > > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
> > > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>
> > Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
> > courts have been a big challenge
> > for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
> > final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
> > way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
> > the animosity?
>
> > > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>
> > If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
> > posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.
>
> -Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
> France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
> *do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.- Hide quoted text =
-
>
> - Show quoted text -

Sure it does. I used to play at a higher level. Maybe 5.5. You don't
have to be a pro to be playing money
tournaments in France. I wasn't suggesting I was winning those
tournaments :), although my friend and I did win some doubles event
somewhere

As far as Ivanisevic, that was when I was in juniors. I lost to a guy
the round before I woulda played Goran. That was a funny story. He
went absolutely berserk after losing the first 4 games to the guy I
lost to, hit four straight returns over the fence. Then he came back
and won like 7-6, 6-0 and went on to win the tournament.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 17:02:47
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:32:08 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
wrote:

>On Jan 31, 8:26 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > On Jan 31, 7:55 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
>> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>>
>> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>>
>> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
>> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
>> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
>> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
>> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
>> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>>
>> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
>> > > > that slight edges can make all
>> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>>
>> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
>> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
>> > > > first hard court final
>>
>> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
>> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
>> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>>
>> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>>
>> > > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.."  Really now. A tough
>> > > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
>> > > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>>
>> > Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
>> > courts have been a big challenge
>> > for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
>> > final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
>> > way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
>> > the animosity?
>>
>> > > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>>
>> > If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
>> > posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.
>>
>> -Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
>> France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
>> *do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>Sure it does. I used to play at a higher level. Maybe 5.5. You don't
>have to be a pro to be playing money
>tournaments in France. I wasn't suggesting I was winning those
>tournaments :), although my friend and I did win some doubles event
>somewhere
>
>As far as Ivanisevic, that was when I was in juniors. I lost to a guy
>the round before I woulda played Goran. That was a funny story. He
>went absolutely berserk after losing the first 4 games to the guy I
>lost to, hit four straight returns over the fence. Then he came back
>and won like 7-6, 6-0 and went on to win the tournament.

I got curious and checked by the name Catlin from ITF database. All I
found was Marissa Catlin. I found Ivanisevic junior matches from
1987-88. So I guess it was something else than ITF junior tournaments?


   
Date: 31 Jan 2009 16:32:13
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match

"Sakari Lund" <sakari.lund@welho.com > wrote in message
news:1kp8o4l4tssb7cbj8scmo99t6aenovie9r@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:32:08 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>>On Jan 31, 8:26 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> > On Jan 31, 7:55 am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> > > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> > > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or
>>> > > > sadism
>>> > > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>>>
>>> > > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay
>>> > > > surfaces.
>>>
>>> > > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
>>> > > > stellar, plenty good enough
>>> > > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on
>>> > > > with
>>> > > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
>>> > > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not
>>> > > > typically
>>> > > > the formula for success off of clay.
>>>
>>> > > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we
>>> > > > know
>>> > > > that slight edges can make all
>>> > > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>>>
>>> > > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career,
>>> > > > whereas
>>> > > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
>>> > > > first hard court final
>>>
>>> > > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall
>>> > > > head 2
>>> > > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on
>>> > > > a
>>> > > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>>>
>>> > > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in
>>> > > > favor
>>> > > > of Fed on Sunday.
>>>
>>> > > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." Really now. A tough
>>> > > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
>>> > > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>>>
>>> > Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
>>> > courts have been a big challenge
>>> > for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
>>> > final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
>>> > way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
>>> > the animosity?
>>>
>>> > > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>>>
>>> > If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
>>> > posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.
>>>
>>> -Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
>>> France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
>>> *do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.- Hide quoted
>>> text -
>>>
>>> - Show quoted text -
>>
>>Sure it does. I used to play at a higher level. Maybe 5.5. You don't
>>have to be a pro to be playing money
>>tournaments in France. I wasn't suggesting I was winning those
>>tournaments :), although my friend and I did win some doubles event
>>somewhere
>>
>>As far as Ivanisevic, that was when I was in juniors. I lost to a guy
>>the round before I woulda played Goran. That was a funny story. He
>>went absolutely berserk after losing the first 4 games to the guy I
>>lost to, hit four straight returns over the fence. Then he came back
>>and won like 7-6, 6-0 and went on to win the tournament.
>
> I got curious and checked by the name Catlin from ITF database. All I
> found was Marissa Catlin. I found Ivanisevic junior matches from
> 1987-88. So I guess it was something else than ITF junior tournaments?


stalker




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:30:02
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 1:07=A0pm, "Stapler" <d...@d.com > wrote:
> "Petter Solbu" <pettermann1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:u7udnXUaMqKY1hnU4p2dnAA@telenor.com...
>
> > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> >> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> >> of Fed on Sunday.
>
> > The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
> > 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
> > favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>
> > PS.
>
> How do you know recovery will be no issue? 40 hours to recover from dead
> legs, blisters, etc... I don't think he can be 100% in that amount of tim=
e.

Has Nadal got blisters?


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 14:00:12
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:30:02 -0800 (PST), gregorawe@hotmail.com wrote:

>On Jan 31, 1:07 pm, "Stapler" <d...@d.com> wrote:
>> "Petter Solbu" <pettermann1...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>> news:u7udnXUaMqKY1hnU4p2dnAA@telenor.com...
>>
>> > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> >> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> >> of Fed on Sunday.
>>
>> > The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
>> > 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
>> > favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>>
>> > PS.
>>
>> How do you know recovery will be no issue? 40 hours to recover from dead
>> legs, blisters, etc... I don't think he can be 100% in that amount of time.
>
>Has Nadal got blisters?

Yes, as well as "hemmorhoids".


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:26:47
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Jan 31, 7:55=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
> >
> > > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
> >
> > > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > > stellar, plenty good enough
> > > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > > the formula for success off of clay.
> >
> > > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > > that slight edges can make all
> > > the difference at the highest level of sport.
> >
> > > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, wherea=
s
> > > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > > first hard court final
> >
> > > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
> >
> > > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > > of Fed on Sunday.
> >
> > "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." =A0Really now. A tough
> > semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
> > tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...
>
> Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
> courts have been a big challenge
> for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
> final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
> way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
> the animosity?
>
> >
> > Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-
>
> If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
> posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.

-Didn't you talk about playing *money tournaments in
France* v Ivanisovic or somesuch? That and ntrp 5.0
*do not compute*, Captain... keep your story straight.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:25:21
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 8:19=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > stellar, plenty good enough
> > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > that slight edges can make all
> > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > first hard court final
>
> > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> If Catlin really played tennis, he was a runner with a
> two-hander. And no power. (Just a lucky guess)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Actually, good guess! Yeah, I never thought of myself as a really
talented player.

I play pretty smart, play good D and don't beat myself, have a pretty
heavy forehand that bothers players 4.5 and below quite a lot. I do
have a 2-hander but I can't really hurt players with it much and
pretty much go cross-court 85% of the time, again with a fair amount
of top. I do have a good slice though and so I try to mix that in
quite a bit and go down the line with it to put people in
uncomfortable positions, since I don't have the ability to crack dtl
backhands for winners.

Along with my forehand, my serve is a fairly decent weapon for my
level. I usually hit between 5-10 aces a match. My volleys are decent
but I only serve-volley sparingly. Should do it more.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:19:19
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
>
> He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> stellar, plenty good enough
> to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> the formula for success off of clay.
>
> Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> that slight edges can make all
> the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> first hard court final
>
> Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

If Catlin really played tennis, he was a runner with a
two-hander. And no power. (Just a lucky guess)


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:14:17
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


Petter Solbu wrote:
> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>
> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>
> PS.

Petter has it about right.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:43:44
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:14:17 -0800 (PST), Carey <carey_1959@yahoo.com >
wrote:

>
>
>Petter Solbu wrote:
>> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> > of Fed on Sunday.
>>
>> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
>> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
>> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>>
>> PS.
>
> Petter has it about right.


He way way off the mark. Fed is going to kill Rafa. It will be a
"brutal" display too.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 15:16:36
From: TT
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
Carey wrote:
>
> Petter Solbu wrote:
>> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>>> of Fed on Sunday.
>> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
>> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
>> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>>
>> PS.
>
> Petter has it about right.

That would be first...

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


   
Date: 31 Jan 2009 16:56:27
From: Petter Solbu
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
TT wrote:
> Carey wrote:
>>
>> Petter Solbu wrote:
>>> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
>>>> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>>>> of Fed on Sunday.
>>> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
>>> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
>>> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>>>
>>> PS.
>>
>> Petter has it about right.
>
> That would be first...
>

First time I am right? :-)

PS.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:12:55
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 7:58=A0am, TT <g...@Olympics.org > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> Sadism? Posts that say Nadal wins make you suffer that much? :)

Huh? Nadal's one of my favorite players.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:54:15
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:12:55 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
wrote:

>On Jan 31, 7:58 am, TT <g...@Olympics.org> wrote:
>> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
>> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
>> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>>
>> Sadism? Posts that say Nadal wins make you suffer that much? :)
>
>Huh? Nadal's one of my favorite players.


i can't imagine why ?

because he plays UGLY tennis ?
because he is a BUMROOTER ?
because all he can play is DEFENSE ?
because he runs like a COCKAROACH ?
because he picks his ass a LOT ?
because he CHEATS ?

oh wait I know !

It's because of his lil magic bottles right ?


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 05:11:40
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 7:55=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > stellar, plenty good enough
> > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > that slight edges can make all
> > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > first hard court final
>
> > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> "Rafa scraped his way to the final.." =A0Really now. A tough
> semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
> tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...

Well, ok. Maybe that wasn't the best choice of words. The fact is hard
courts have been a big challenge
for Rafa and even when a lot here were predicting a cakewalk to the
final he ended up in a major dogfight against Verdasco. And by the
way, I do play tennis at around a 5.0 level. Any particular reason for
the animosity?

>
> Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.-

If you were being fair, you'd notice I never say *clown era* and have
posted retorts to Whisper several times when he starts up with that.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:58:18
From: Petter Solbu
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:

> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.

PS.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:07:15
From: Stapler
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
"Petter Solbu" <pettermann1984@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:u7udnXUaMqKY1hnU4p2dnAA@telenor.com...
> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> of Fed on Sunday.
>
> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>
> PS.


How do you know recovery will be no issue? 40 hours to recover from dead
legs, blisters, etc... I don't think he can be 100% in that amount of time.



   
Date: 31 Jan 2009 16:00:27
From: Petter Solbu
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
Stapler wrote:

> How do you know recovery will be no issue? 40 hours to recover from dead
> legs, blisters, etc... I don't think he can be 100% in that amount of time.

I don't know, but I think he will recover. Yes, it was a long match, but
tennis athletes are supposed to recover from these when they get a day
off and his previous matches have also been really short (easy).

PS.


   
Date: 31 Jan 2009 13:42:54
From: Dave Hazelwood
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 13:07:15 GMT, "Stapler" <d@d.com > wrote:

>"Petter Solbu" <pettermann1984@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:u7udnXUaMqKY1hnU4p2dnAA@telenor.com...
>> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>>> of Fed on Sunday.
>>
>> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
>> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
>> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.
>>
>> PS.
>
>
>How do you know recovery will be no issue? 40 hours to recover from dead
>legs, blisters, etc... I don't think he can be 100% in that amount of time.


it's more like 36 hours vs Fed's 60+ hours after only a 3 setter.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 14:01:00
From: *skriptis
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match

"Petter Solbu" <pettermann1984@hotmail.com > wrote in message
news:u7udnXUaMqKY1hnU4p2dnAA@telenor.com...
> jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>> of Fed on Sunday.
>
> The head2head is important in this case. Nadal won all their matches in
> 2008. And Nadal is continuously improving on HC. I would say 60/40 in
> favor of Nadal. Recovery will be no issue here, I think.


I think it will have some effect. 63/37 in favour of Federer




 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 14:58:09
From: TT
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.

Sadism? Posts that say Nadal wins make you suffer that much? :)


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 04:55:31
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
>
> He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> stellar, plenty good enough
> to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> the formula for success off of clay.
>
> Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> that slight edges can make all
> the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> first hard court final
>
> Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

"Rafa scraped his way to the final.." Really now. A tough
semi; otherwise straights all the way. You claim to be a
tennis player? Hmm. I once thought you were...

Lisper's lackey is more like it; why, I wouldn't know.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 14:55:29
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 04:30:35 -0800 (PST), jasoncatlin1971@gmail.com
wrote:

>instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
>(Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
>
>He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
>With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
>stellar, plenty good enough
>to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
>big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
>player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
>the formula for success off of clay.
>
>Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
>that slight edges can make all
>the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
>Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
>Rafa has just scraped his way to his
>first hard court final
>
>Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
>head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
>hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
>But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
>of Fed on Sunday.

I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
for 14 affects him.





  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 15:34:51
From: Yama
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
Sakari Lund <sakari.lund@welho.com > wrote:
: I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
: Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
: Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
: how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
: for 14 affects him.

I saw Haas match, then some of the Simon and Verdasco matches. Against Haas
Nadal looked really sharp & quick. But in his last two matches he has
looked kinda lethargic. It does not bode well for the finals.

Lots of legacy stakes here. Federer is of course going for Pete's record
and to prove he can beat Nadal on hardcourts. If Nadal wins, he will be
just 1 slam short of career GS and would own very rare AO-FO-W combo.

Anyway, I think Fed is a clear favourite based on Nadal's somewhat
unimpressive performance in last two matches. Lets say 70-30. Nadal
is not without chances, but needs help from Federer.


  
Date: 31 Jan 2009 15:00:58
From: TT
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
Sakari Lund wrote:

> I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
> Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
> Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
> how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
> for 14 affects him.
>
>

Fedfucking position. It depends on Nadal's play too. And on how well has
he recovered.


--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


   
Date: 31 Jan 2009 15:36:32
From: Sakari Lund
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:00:58 +0200, TT <gold@Olympics.org > wrote:

>Sakari Lund wrote:
>
>> I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
>> Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
>> Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
>> how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
>> for 14 affects him.
>>
>>
>
>Fedfucking position. It depends on Nadal's play too. And on how well has
>he recovered.

I have said Federer has an advantage because of Nadal's long SF, but I
hope Fed-haters don't use that as an excuse. That's part of winning a
slam. But I am afraid they will do it. As for Nadal's play, my opinion
after Simon and Verdasco matches is that that level will not be
enough.



    
Date: 31 Jan 2009 16:05:47
From: TT
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
Sakari Lund wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:00:58 +0200, TT <gold@Olympics.org> wrote:
>
>> Sakari Lund wrote:
>>
>>> I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
>>> Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
>>> Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
>>> how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
>>> for 14 affects him.
>>>
>>>
>> Fedfucking position. It depends on Nadal's play too. And on how well has
>> he recovered.
>
> I have said Federer has an advantage because of Nadal's long SF, but I
> hope Fed-haters don't use that as an excuse. That's part of winning a
> slam. But I am afraid they will do it. As for Nadal's play, my opinion
> after Simon and Verdasco matches is that that level will not be
> enough.
>

Obviously you didn't Haas match.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


     
Date: 31 Jan 2009 16:06:13
From: TT
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
TT wrote:
> Sakari Lund wrote:
>> On Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:00:58 +0200, TT <gold@Olympics.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Sakari Lund wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've seen Nadal's first match, which was a joke, then some of the
>>>> Simon match and the whole Verdasco thriller. Based on Simon and
>>>> Verdasco matches, Nadal is definitely beatable here. The question is
>>>> how big problem Federer has mentally with Nadal. And how much going
>>>> for 14 affects him.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Fedfucking position. It depends on Nadal's play too. And on how well
>>> has he recovered.
>>
>> I have said Federer has an advantage because of Nadal's long SF, but I
>> hope Fed-haters don't use that as an excuse. That's part of winning a
>> slam. But I am afraid they will do it. As for Nadal's play, my opinion
>> after Simon and Verdasco matches is that that level will not be
>> enough.
>>
>
> Obviously you didn't Haas match.
>

...see Haas match.

--
"Now I have so many dreams to chase - the French Open, an Olympic
singles gold medal in London in 2012, the Davis Cup for Switzerland"


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 04:49:41
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 7:42=A0am, Carey <carey_1...@yahoo.com > wrote:
> jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> > instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> > (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> > He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> > With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> > stellar, plenty good enough
> > to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> > big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> > player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> > the formula for success off of clay.
>
> > Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> > that slight edges can make all
> > the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> > Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> > Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> > first hard court final
>
> > Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> > head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> > hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> > But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> > of Fed on Sunday.
>
> You're a funny joke. Keep tryin' with the 'unbiased'
> bit. :)- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Right, so people who don't think Fed walks on water must also think
that he's a totally overrated fraud
who was just lucky to be playing in a clown era and will now never win
another Slam.


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 04:42:57
From: Carey
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match


jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
>
> He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> stellar, plenty good enough
> to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> the formula for success off of clay.
>
> Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> that slight edges can make all
> the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> first hard court final
>
> Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

You're a funny joke. Keep tryin' with the 'unbiased'
bit. :)


 
Date: 31 Jan 2009 04:32:44
From:
Subject: Re: If we take a big-picture look at this match
On Jan 31, 7:30=A0am, jasoncatlin1...@gmail.com wrote:
> instead of making predictions based on fear (some Fed fans) or sadism
> (Fed haters), we have to give the edge to Fed.
>
> He has a winning record lifetime against Rafa on non-clay surfaces.
>
> With the exception of 2 sets against Berdych, his form has been
> stellar, plenty good enough
> to win the title, whereas Verdasco showed that a player who's on with
> big weapons can turn Rafa into a defensive
> player retrieving from well beyond the baseline. That's not typically
> the formula for success off of clay.
>
> Rafa HAS to be a little bit tired. He is human after all. And we know
> that slight edges can make all
> the difference at the highest level of sport.
>
> Fed has great belief on hard courts. He's won 8 in his career, whereas
> Rafa has just scraped his way to his
> first hard court final
>
> Now, of course there are factors in Rafa's favor, like overall head 2
> head, match-up issues (which are obviously much less pronounced on a
> hard court), youth, Fed being a little past peak
>
> But taking everything into consideration, I'd say it's 65/35 in favor
> of Fed on Sunday.

And of course the x-factor of going for #14. Some would say that's a
negative for Fed. We'll find out.

All I know is that when Fed had 11 Slams, he came out seeming pretty
nervous to me against Djoke.
When he had 12, he came out like a house of fire against Murray.

We'll find out quickly how affected by nerves he is on Sunday.